OPINIONS ON LESS WEIGHTY MATTERS: The Great Toilet Seat Controversy
Women have plenty of reasons to complain about men, to complain about how male behavior injures them, about how it is irresponsible and unfair. But there’s one area of complaint that I am moved to protest.
It is time, at last, to challenge those women who smugly ASSUME that they have the high moral ground when it comes to how toilet seats should and should not be left by a person departing from the bathroom.
The glib assumption is that of course men are delinquent when they leave the toilet seat UP, whereas it’s of course entirely appropriate when women leave the toilet seat down.
I say that the arguments for each side are very close to equal. Either way, if the next person to use the bathroom is of the opposite sex of the one who used it previously, the second person has to reach to change the position of the seat. An equal inconvenience, it seems to me, either way.
Of course, everyone –including men– has need on some occasions for the toilet seat to be down. It is to this extent –and ONLY to this extent– that the women’s position has a slight advantage in practical terms. It may be supposed that the number of occasions on which the next person will want the seat down is greater than fifty percent. But I would estimate –based on the rather different frequency of various bodily function– that the percentages are closer to equal than not, perhaps on the order of 60-40, or even closer, rather than the 75-25 that would be the case if both bodily functions were equally frequent.
Not so great a distinction to warrant the righteous and condescending attitude that some women take with respect to men doing the same thing they do, which is to say to leave the toilet seat alone after using the toilet.
It might be argued, and indeed it IS argued, that the practical consideration is not the only decision: there is also, it is said, the aesthetic factor. Presumably, it is perfectly obvious that the toilet LOOKS better with the seat down than with the seat up.
That’s not so obvious to me.
Part of this aesthetic case is that having the seat down helps to obscure the practical nature of the toilet, that it is more discreet. OK, reply I, if that’s the goal, I would certainly be willing to endorse a position that goes all the way in that direction: close the toilet altogether, bringing down not only the seat but the cover as well. That way, BOTH sexes have a cosmetic responsibility upon leaving the bathroom.
(In my limited sample, that idea of having the cover lowered also after use, while it is advocated by a few, is not the position that those women complaining about men are advocating.)
One more point that I believe should be weighed regarding this issue, if the attitudes of women are to be fair to men. We men were once boys, and as boys most of us were determinedly trained by the women in our families to RAISE the toilet seat in the first place. We were given to understand that, for those who sit on toilet seats, it was not a pleasure to be the one who followed a boy who failed to raise the seat. Raising the seat in the first place, in other words, is already a product of male consideration of female needs and demands.
As for making a major issue subsequently about demanding the seat subsequently be lowered, I say: don’t overreach.
February 12th, 2010 at 9:00 am
Hey Andy, in some ways, we think alike. I also thought that if the argument was aesthetic, then it made sense that all should put the toilet cover down. Of course, my wife objects to this. It’s been a minor irritant for me for years though. Not sure if it will change, but so it goes.
February 12th, 2010 at 9:39 am
I agree with you that it’s not the major issue, but I’m a lid-down-too guy. I have a tiny bathroom with no racks, so if the lid is down the toilet is a handy place to temporarily stow something while I’m in the shower.
February 12th, 2010 at 11:57 am
While I have never been one to insist a man put the seat down, being in the field of hygiene, I do strongly suggest that when the wastes are solid, at least, either party should put down both the seat and the lid before flushing. This cuts the amount of germs that get into the air significantly. I am told that one should not store one’s toothbrush within four feet of the toilet because of the germs that get into the air from it.
What I do advocate, is that everyone in the family should have their own toilet and should have to clean it themselves. I realize this is wasteful and luxurious, but it sure keeps the peace!
February 12th, 2010 at 1:08 pm
When I was an undergrad the girls in a couple sorority houses (in close proximity to the frat house) always had a colorful big note posted on the the front of their toilet instructing all boys to show respect by leaving the seat in its proper flipped down position. You did not want to get on the wrong side of that one, especially with some of the tenacious young women I remember going to school with, yikes!! One guy could ruin it for nearly everyone
.
February 12th, 2010 at 4:23 pm
I like the seat AND the lid down. That keeps the dogs, cats, babies, and occasional falling items out of the toilet, thank you.
February 12th, 2010 at 5:45 pm
As one who has always felt strongly about this issue, I maintain that if by accident women sit down with the toilet seat up (I agree it might happen rarely!) that this is much more revolting that men half-asleep peeing with the seat down..
Anyway, I’m happy my husband has learned to accommodate me in this way – after all, I accommodate his needs in myriad other ways!
Livvie
February 12th, 2010 at 5:59 pm
I appreciate, Livvie, all the ways you accommodate your husband. But why is it too much for people of both varieties to check out the seat situation before sitting or otherwise proceeding with the task at hand?
February 12th, 2010 at 7:50 pm
Living with two boys, I actually prefer the toilet seat to be up. This way I can be sure that I won’t once again sit down on a peed upon toilet seat.
February 12th, 2010 at 9:59 pm
Elizabeth had me well trained on this issue. Her argument was that when she got up in the middle of the night to go to the bathroom, she did not want to turn the light on — nor did she want to fall into the toilet in the dark. As one more bit of evidence on the persistence of habit, even though she died over four years ago, I still put the seat down! (Maybe it is a subconscious way of honoring her memory.)
But one more observation: the odds you mention in your piece change significantly with the gender balance in the household. I have a married friend with five daughters. You can imagine the pressures on him to conform.
February 12th, 2010 at 10:10 pm
I certainly would agree, Ken Mayers, that the proportions involved influence what justice demands. Greatest good for the greatest number! Majority rules! (And all that.) Married with five daughters, I would think that lowering the seat was only fair.
As it is, I am particularly mindful at night of the very problem your late wife cited, of the mishap in the dark. My own wife has the same concern, and while I will often leave both seat and cover down when she is asleep, I do not leave the seat up, believing that she ought not to have to be the least bit vigilant in a half-asleep state.
February 14th, 2010 at 5:04 pm
My solution to women going to the bathroom at night is to install dimmer switches on all bathrooms so the lights can only just barely be on so as not to blind or damage the ability to see in the dark and yet have enough light to see the state of the toilet and it’s integral seat and lid. I’ve put them on the two bathrooms upstairs near the bedrooms so this can be done. Not sure if my wife partakes of the opportunity, but it is there.
February 16th, 2010 at 2:40 pm
Andy,
This is by far your best essay yet.
March 2nd, 2010 at 11:30 pm
If we still lived like our ancestors, beyond all modern conveniences,, disposing of the body’s waste would be no problem. As it is, keeping the lid down is safer, for all small things. Throughout my life, I always leaned down to deposit my bladders content making it easier by far for who ever has to clean up. This comes from working in hospital as a ‘house-person”
Greetings all the NSB crew from a new “home”… (which isn’t really).
Namaste….
March 3rd, 2010 at 8:48 am
Good to hear from you again, Lee. I hope you have been, and are, OK.
March 8th, 2010 at 10:41 pm
My bathroom has what is essentially a night-light: it’s the clock radio light. It’s enough light to see if the lid is down — because it has a cover on it that is considerably darker than the white toilet. I don’t know if it is enough light to see if the seat is up — But, in the dark, shouldn’t the guys sit to pee also?